In case you haven’t heard the news, Framework went and publicly sponsored Hyprland the most toxic part of Wayland by a country mile) and openly shilled Omarchy multiple times (the pet project of fascist shithead David Heinemeier Hansson) recently.
In response to well-justified backlash against this, founder Nirav Patel responded with FOSSbro platitudes about “[creating] a big tent" for open source”.
If you’ve got any more updates on this self-inflicted shitshow, put them here so they can be collected in one place.
(In retrospect, that AI-pilled Framework Desktop should’ve been a major red flag they were gonna pull this shit.)
Quick update: Nirav is posting through it on Twitter
This reply is worth quoting at length:
With all due respect, I think you profoundly misunderstand the nature of my concern here.
This is not a “I do not like this distribution” kind of argument.
This is a “the people you are sending my money to want me and my friends dead or deported” kind of argument.
The “big tent” argument works fine if everyone plays by some basic civil rules of understanding. Stuff like code of conducts, moderation, anti-racism, surely those things we agree on? A big tent won’t work if you let in people that want to exterminate the others.
I have no problem with Fedora, Bluefin, Bazzite, Arch Linux, Linux Mint, Linux Foundation, LVFS, Debian, KDE… What I have a problem is with Framework consistently, repeatedly encouraging and now sponsoring individuals that have shown to be absolutely destructive to the open source community.
Claiming that this “increasing the adoption of open source software” really misses the core part of the narrative here, which is that those people have been excluded from open source communities because they were so hateful, so destructive, that their mere presence was more harmful than beneficial.
DHH is a threat to the free software community as a whole at this point. The damage he ended up doing to the Ruby community might end up outweighing entirely his contributions to Rails, which is no small feat.
Vaxry (from hyprland) was banned from freedesktop.org, wrecking havoc in standardizing Wayland protocols that the whole community could have benefited from.
If you believe helping and sponsoring those people helps the open source community, we have quite divergent views on the best way forward and, perhaps, it is best if you concentrate on making hardware and leave the open source community alone.
In any case, thanks for your quick response, @nrp, and thanks for building those awesome products.
“[I]ncreasing the adoption of open source software” is such a bullshit argument here anyway, holy shit lol.
They’re not sponsoring Asahi Linux or FOSS Nvidia drivers but DHH’s fucking Arch setup and Ratpoison but worse and with rounded corners.
Oh for fuck’s sake
MNT are still good, right? IIRC, all firmware is open-source with no binary blobs, and they’re a small group of queers in Berlin. (Please tell me they’re not antideutsche tankies or something.)
What’s it with fascists and unintuitive, keyboard-based user interaction? Is this a weird “gatekeeping” thing? Because I remember that in the late 2000’s, a lot of Linux forums had “let me google it for you” and pirated copies of Windows XP linked instead of getting an answer to your problem.
What’s unintuitive about creating text files
config.yamlandinput.tomlin$DESKTOP_STANDARD_INCONSISTENTLY_FOLLOWEDwhich hopefully resolves to/home/username/.config/but probably resolves to/usr/bin/go_fuck_yourself_with_1s_and_0sand then editing the text files according to confusingly documented syntax?To answer the question, the most unintuitive part of that is YAML.
There’s nothing more cursed than unquoted strings.
It’s 4chan /g/ culture at large
I love googling something, and the top results are from reddit or other forums, and most of the comments are telling the OP to google it.
From the stubstack: https://awful.systems/comment/9014362 https://awful.systems/post/5853532/9014330
Man fuck that. I dont expect a tech company to be great. But I have a 13” and was excited to see these keep getting better. But that response is just bullshit. There are legitimate business reasons aside from all of the many moral ones not to support bullshit reprehensible creators and by doing so publicly connect your company to them. If they can’t even see the dollar signs there… well… fuck em.
Maybe I’ll start quoting the Hyprland fucks in the framework forums and see if that language flies or gets taken down.
Is this the same Framework that develops very promising modular and repairable laptops, one of three companies to do so? If so… Fuck.
I am so sorry to tell you this, but its the exact same Framework developing modular and repairable laptops.
Who are the other companies?
- Shift, an ecoconscious, as-yet untainted tech brand from Germany
- I thought Lenovo, but I seem to be wrong - they were playing with concepts, nothing on the market yet.
- If you wish to buy from Shift you might need to enable a translator, as I believe their store is only in German.
- The only by me some people have picked at in terms of Shift’s ethical values is that they manufacture in China, but they maintain that their labour standards within the factory are kept high
I am often skeptical of tablet/keyboard hybrid designs (the PineTab 2 has not exactly been a roaring success for me) but that ShiftBook is straight-up a more visually appealing design than any Framework
HP launched modular laptop, and Dell did a concept.
Of course, this is largely in response to Framework. Not like they’d do it on their own.
Yeah…
So they need my money to make their tent bigger, and inside that tent they let racists and toxic fuckers in?
Very fortunate that I have not given them a cent.
I was so close to ordering a framework 16 the other day, but got a strange feeling in my gut and backed off just before paying. maybe I’ll just settle for a used lenovo. it was food poisoning btw.
The absolute shitshow that’s been some of the most visible open source projects recently just reinforces my thoughts that one cannot establish trust (and therefore support) with any project leads unless they show their political affiliations upfront. The same way we demand to see a Foss license, we should expect to see what kind of person someone is before we use our community support to elevate them in any position of technical authority.
Shoutout to gleam.run whose web page has always (AFAIK) said
Black lives matter. Trans rights are human rights. No nazi bullsh*t.
Nice, the language itself also looks pretty cool, which you love to see.
I feel like like I’ve seen the phrase “hyprland is the most toxic part of Wayland” more than once now and I’m not sure why it’s being phrased that way. Hyprland is not part of wayland, right?
you’ve seen it from me as “the most toxic part of the Wayland ecosystem, and that’s saying something”
(In retrospect, that AI-pilled Framework Desktop should’ve been a major red flag they were gonna pull this shit.)
I am still not completely sure why this product should exist in their lineup. Their laptops have always focused on being more repairable/upgradeable than most competing laptops, but the Framework Desktop is actually less repairable/upgradeable than a standard desktop that you can build yourself however you please. Though if you instead compare it to a mini PC form factor like an Intel NUC, it is actually a very attractive alternative. Either way, at the end of the day, no one asked for this device. People enjoy Framework for the things that they are doing to make the laptop industry more consumer-friendly. But apparently the reason that the Framework Desktop was developed is just because the CEO saw AMD’s new CPU platform and thought “I want to put that into a Framework product.” And after they tried working with AMD to get standard memory modules to work with it, instead of saying, “Oh, there’s no way to make it repairable/upgradeable? Never mind, we just won’t make a Framework product out of it,” they went ahead and did it anyway.
Maybe they’re competing with the old Mac desktops, the cheesegraters before they were made completely proprietary. Now, I’ve always dissed Apple consumers for buying a phone that’s 50% more expensive and 20% less powerful or feature-filled than the competition, but once I learned the going price of Mac desktops are 300% more expensive than the most capable custom, my mind was blown.
And yet Apple’s success and following is proof that Framework’s desktop might follow suit.
While I agree that the Hyprland community is toxic and led by an open conservative (if not fascist), citing Drew DeVault’s opinion piece is hardly better; he’s known for being a tankie with biases of his own and the way he manages sway is toxic in its own way (though, admittedly, not in the same manner that Hyprland is).
oh yeah totally, open transphobia and fascism is just as bad as being
known for being a tankie with biases of his own
the fuck is wrong with you. this is what centrism does to a motherfucker.
(and for the record, devault’s firmly wedged in my brain as a particularly dramatic neoliberal with a checkered past, but the fucker brings receipts (yes this is the same link in the OP that our guest decided to complain about, go read it because it’s fucking damning))
Critical support for comrade DeVault in his struggle against western imperialism?
The real problem with leftist infighting is that if you call a different type of leftist a mean word, some ignorant liberal is going to call you the same word. And then a reactionary will call a liberal that.
And Vaxry’s defense of the community was “actually, we harassed a transphobe a few months later.” Yes, great, you’re shitty to everyone. Yay.
