• Blue_Morpho@lemmy.world
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        8 months ago

        NATO means nothing because Trump won’t back NATO if a NATO country is attacked. Trump wouldn’t defend the US even if the US was invaded.

        Going forward, Europe needs to assume there’s no US. If they can’t supply Ukraine, they can’t supply NATO.

        • theUwUhugger@lemmy.world
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          8 months ago

          Eu membership entails that we defend each other! Its just never was called for bef

          But Russia really broke its fangs into Ukraine, the big strong russian warmachine can’t deal with lil poor Ukraine… So its not like our mutual def pack will be called now!

            • barsoap@lemm.ee
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              8 months ago

              Like this? Like switching domestic heating over to heat pumps? Germany isn’t planning on using any fossil gas in the future, the stuff that will be left (because it cannot be avoided, e.g. as chemical feedstock, or to reduce iron ore) will be green hydrogen.

              Also I’m sorry you don’t like Gepards, or Leopards. Or Lynxes. Big cats in general.

              • AnUnusualRelic@lemmy.world
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                8 months ago

                You haven’t been following the innumerable articles about German industries wringing their hands and moaning about the good old days of cheap energy. They might be cajoling the general public, but the corporations are suffering and having trouble adapting. Everything was designed around cheap Russian gas. And they’ve thrown all of their nuclear infrastructure away because of their rabid ecologist party (which has in part contaminated their French neighbours).

                • barsoap@lemm.ee
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                  8 months ago

                  Nuclear is no replacement for the critical uses of gas, noone wants to build it anyway because it’s expensive AF, and yes of course companies are moaning. They always are.

                  A full 1/3rd of German gas use is domestic heating which is getting replaced by heat pumps now, up to 70% of the replacement costs get covered by the state. Because, apparently, Germany wants to stick with Russian gas? Meanwhile, French industry uses ballpark the same amount of gas as the German industry. Yet noone is talking about the French industry controlling the French state, making them bow to Russians.

                  The fuck are you people talking about. What parallel dimension are you living in.

                • barsoap@lemm.ee
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                  8 months ago
                  1. Completely irrelevant to the topic at hand
                  2. Neither is Ukraine losing nor has the support been spotty. It could certainly be more intense, but it has been steady.
                  3. Where is what money? Our defence budget has been a joke for ages.

                  Go back to lemmygrad, FUD there.

        • theUwUhugger@lemmy.world
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          8 months ago

          What is the eu supposed to do? Unlike the US our hand down equipment is shet, ukraine doesn’t want it unlike the us stockpile? So we have and will fund the war!

          The unfortunate and sensitive truth of the war is, that russia has to “win”! It does if doesn’t want to repeat the October revolution! The thing is it can’t, what do you think what the fuck would happen if Ukraine got its nukes and strategic bomber fleet back bec russia broke the budapest accord? That Putin would shy away from a nuclear war if his gilded throne starts shaking?

            • Krik@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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              8 months ago

              I’ll make you recall this comment when a Russian bomb tore your place apart just because the EU started to be credible.

              There are 450m EU citizens at risk. Those are the ones the EU member countries have to care about. Yeah, we hate what Putin did to UA but our priority is EU first and there’s nothing wrong about that.

              Deploying EU troops on UA territory and let them fight Russian soldiers directly will be seen as an act of war. That’s not yet another red line that Russia set up and people ignored. Putin will warm up whatever nukes he has left - not as a threat but as a weapon to use.

              And then what? Would you risk everything just to prove what a mean boy you are?

              • Blue_Morpho@lemmy.world
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                8 months ago

                Deploying EU troops on UA territory

                Ukraine doesn’t ask for that. They only need weapons which you won’t give.

                • Krik@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                  8 months ago

                  UA wants security guarantees. Deploying Western troops on their territory to secure the borders is a security guarantee.
                  That is what can prevent another attack by Russia. RUS would have to attack these troops to advance which would trigger not just a war against UA (again) but also against whom those troops belong to.

                  And yeah, UA needs more weapons.

                • angrystego@lemmy.world
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                  8 months ago

                  That’s unfortunately exactly the case. Europeans forgot. Pro-Putin populists and nazis are on the rise in many European countries.

                • Krik@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                  8 months ago

                  Oh we remember our history very clearly. We are currently in the most peaceful period of our continent since its colonization. And we clearly need that peace because the last wars on this continent were more bloodier and deathly than the ones before.

                  If Europe decides to return to ye old days there won’t just be a litte squabble at the edges - WW3 will happen! Don’t you realize that?

                • tabarnaski@sh.itjust.works
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                  8 months ago

                  Would you have your own country’s military deploy in Ukraine? Would you, personally, go help Ukrainians fight the Russian invaders? This ain’t age of empires. In the real world, nobody wants to go to war. This is why in a democracy, elected leaders might hesitate whereas dictators don’t really mind spending a few thousand lives to make a point.

            • theUwUhugger@lemmy.world
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              8 months ago

              Because you americans sent your troops in? Need I remind you again that while your are handing down your worn out military equipment, we are going into debt to fund the Ukrainian war?

              But I am going to ask you once again to think about what you typed! Oki, eu goes in with the troops, now what? Putin leader of strong big russian war machine, who by his own propaganda does claims to be able to rekt nato in it’s entirety, is not only threatened by the shame of not being capable of dealing with small poor ukraine and recreating the conditions of the oktober revolution but an actual invasion of a wildly superior force? Nuclear war! Nuclear war that will destroy all of europe including that of ukraine! But you don’t live here do you? Why would you care for hundreds of millions of lives here you american cunt!

              I know this is going to be a strange concept for you, an american cunt, but the eu does not want to become a colonialist power! Unlike you american fucks we don’t want to risk nuclear armageddon so that your collective minuscular cock seems ever little larger!