The smoke definitely is too much for me, at least.
It was the worst part about living in China, too. Can’t go anywhere public without just being overwhelmed by the stench of cigarette smoke because everyone is a smoker.
When I once told a coworker I didn’t smoke, they thought I had some sort of condition. Like people couldn’t even imagine it was just a preference.
Yeah, smoking bans and discouraging it is absolutely something the US done very well. It’s one of the few american things I’m envious of.
I think laws like that wouldn’t pass now. It’d be seized as ammo for the culture war and anti-smoking would be woke and all that.
Freedom sticks.
Ok but seriously, how do we start turning this culture war shit on conservatives cuz convincing a ton of them to start smoking would be a net benefit - imo.
You want second hand cancer again? I’ll stick with letting them take horse paste to cure the measles.
German here, albeit not a (tobacco) smoker. The only places where you can lawfully smoke nowadays are public spaces and specifically designated areas on private properties, which are also physically separated from the non smoking areas.
There are also some Kneipen (roughly equivalent to pubs) which allow smoking anywhere inside, catering to the smoking demographic; although those tend to be frequented by older people who are used to smoking while having a drink. Well there are also the alternative places which definitely have a younger clientele, some allow it anywhere some don’t (and have a designated area outside as most other places do).
Ultimately though I believe we have a fair compromise going; and i am always taken aback by people being zealously anti tobacco anywhere, with no regard for individual liberties. Who then throw up their hands when I ask for a ban on personal cars.
Because smoking anything in public is always intruding on everybody else’s right to not have an increased risk of lung cancer. And it smells horrible. I’m fine with smoking in areas where everyone has consented to it, but public spaces like outdoor seating in restaurants aren’t that.
That’s why driving cars is unconscionable. Especially near schools. Giving lung cancer to children so you can go zoomies is selfish and evil.
You are not owed clean air in public spaces. You are not owed air free of unpleasant smells. Your freedom ends where mine begins.
If you really care about unhealthy things you inhale, why aren’t you spending your time ranting against car ownership? Emissions and tire wear produces magnitudes more harmful particles you inhale every day than being in the general vicinity of someone who smokes.
Naturally you could also ask a smoker to stand downwind from you at the bus stop, or even to not light up in the first place. But the smoker has just as much rights to the public space as you do.
If we try to regulate what smells you might encounter outside there are so. many. things I’d want gone as well because they make me feel sick to my stomach. Perfumes, foods, sweaty asses. Burps and farts.
I understand how annoying public smoking can be, I live essentially next to three bars. Not a weekend evening goes by without some fuckers smoking under my window, forcing me to close it.
But I still support their right to do so (see first paragraph).
What gave you the idea that I support our current car-centric infrastructure? I don’t, for multiple reasons clean air being one of them. But that’s not an issue that can be addressed with one law, smoking in public is.
Your freedom ends where mine begins.
Exactly. And if your freedom to enjoy a public space requires you to impact the enjoyment and health of others that’s where your freedom ends.
I suppose we generally agree but have different priorities regarding what is “impacting other people’s enjoyment and health”.
E: if we agree on no emissions period in public spaces I’m game. I would still tackle cars first and foremost before I’d go after the last public smokers in the country.
Prohibiting smokers is vastly easier than redesigning cities and and convince people to invest trillions in public transportation … are you really that dense?
Clean air should be a human right. That should include pollutants from smoking, pollutants from automobiles, and pollutants from industry and commerce. It’s not a question of one or another.
Lack of clean air is one of the biggest markers of social inequality, and it demonstrably leads to higher rates of respiratory illnesses and earlier deaths for lower-income people who are often forced to live and work in polluted environments with unclean air. It takes a toll on the body over time.
Even just seeing statistics like how asthma rates among children have decreased in places that have banned the sale of gas stoves…like, it shouldn’t be a debate. Whatever people want to do to their own lungs, fine, but given that air is shared by everyone, it should be permitted only in private, where no one else is sharing the same air. It’s not about whether one has a right to smoke or drive wherever they want, but whether one has the right to infringe upon the right of others. The right to health.
Your freedom ends where mine begins.
You say those words but I don’t think you really understand them. It’s a declaration of negative rights, i.e. others aren’t allowed to do something to you. Freedom of speech is such a right in the US as it requires the government to not infringe upon it. This is in contrast to positive rights, e.g. the right to healthcare where somebody has to do something in order to provide the right to others. Read up at https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negative_and_positive_rights
What it absolutely doesn’t mean is: I am allowed to take away your rights by doing whatever I want. We’re talking about smoking, but it could just as easily be pandemic prevention measures (if you were antivax or antimask because muh freedoms, let me know and I won’t waste any more of my time), or shooting a gun into the air (others don’t have the right to not have bullets randomly raining down on them /s). My freedom to not get shot (i.e. life) doesn’t end where your freedom to shoot begins. That’s called murder (or manslaughter etc). I’m not saying it’s the same magnitude as smoking, just using an example to make the situation clearer.
You are not owed clean air in public spaces. You are not owed air free of unpleasant smells.
🤓
What’s that supposed to say?
He’s mocking you, probably because you sound like Nestle saying access to clean water isn’t a human right.
You can still smoke in some bars?
In Austria they completely outlawed that with the argument, that the workers are forced to work in a smoke filled roomI’m probably one of those old guys, but I really enjoy a cigarette to my “Feierabendbier” and now I’m pretty much never going to a bar anymore, because at home I can have that combination…
Yup, though they have a “Raucherkneipe” sign outside (and they also tend to smell accordingly even when passing by).
It is true that the staff has to work in there as well but generally they just hire smokers as barkeeps for those places.
Ah, ok, thanks!
Maybe it’s just my personal preference, but I really like that solution, as it doesn’t dictate how I need to live or manage my bar - if I would have one
If you want to make it a smoking one it will generally have to be small enough and not serve any food, at least no proper food (crisps and peanuts are fine).
It depends on the state. Maps in reading direction: a) Public agencies of state and municipalities, b) prisons, c) gymnasia, pools, and similar, d) places of culture (community halls, museums, etc) e) taverns and pubs. Colors red complete smoking ban, yellow exceptions possible, green separate smoking areas, grey no rules / exempt.
That’s a high-level overview you get more fine-grained exceptions, say general smoking bans at hospitals but psych wards are exempt because have you ever tried to stop a schizophrenic from self-medicating.
Some people may now be wondering “wait, Bavaria has a complete ban on smoking in pubs” and, yes. They have a snuff tradition to fall back on. Also CSU = Verbotspartei.
Can we have both? Banning cars and smoking sounds beautiful.
I’d be fine with that as well
So glad I quit. Think it’s been 5 years now. Not precisely sure why but I don’t get cravings and usually feel revulsion when thinking about it, which is different from my first quit attempt
Mental setting is pretty much everything in nicotine withdrawal - at least in my experience
Physically it just doesn’t do much
I also had to fake smoking on occasion in China, to avoid offending people. I then learned I could accept an offered cigarette and “keep it for later”. By the time I left China though, “I don’t smoke” had become pretty acceptable.
When were you there? I live in Shanghai and people still smoke but it’s really less and less every year. Probably similar to European levels now I think, and it’s usually older men.
Feels like yesterday, but scary to think it was almost 10 years ago. This was near Fuzhou.
That people are still smoking in 2025 given the verified risks involved?
You’re right, that is incomprehensible
Even with my vape, I move away from other people.
It’s addictive that’s why.
Less time in the shit-show, a win in my book.
Yeah that’s a big no for me. I sometimes meet people i haven’t seen in 10 years or so and they all pull out cigarettes and i’m always a bit shocked and like: oh, we’re still doing that? Gross.
France moment
France somehow went from everyone smokes everywhere to no one smokes anywhere bavk to most people smoke some places.
What am I not comprehending?
IDK, it reminds me of my college days in the US.
How we are all the same, the American mind cannot comprehend that
People actually socilazing without fucking phones.
Do you think we don’t do that in the US? The only thing that stands as different in this pic from the downtown area near me is all the cigarettes and stucco.
The open button-up cardigan is something I wouldn’t expect to see in the US, but I could be wrong.
“Is he gay or just European?”
It’s daylight and these folks might hang out for four hours… we have a lovely downtown… but this kind of convivial relaxed atmosphere?? Nah. We might understand it but it’s not part of our lifestyle.
I’m pretty sure that no one at any of these tables has used the phrase “social anxiety” ever.
I guess this image was captured with a palantir then?
Let me tell you about this ancient artifact called a camera…
I think it’s about mixed use zoning, medium density, walkable car free streets. And perhaps drinking under the age of 21 but not so sure on the last one.
Too funny Reading the comments from Americans insisting they comprehend but then saying it’s just about drinking and smoking lol
A woman not wearing a bra?
Drinking under 21?
Smoking?
No fat people?
No flags?
Odd sunglasses wearing style?
Comprehend what? Smoking in public? Drinking in public? Maybe eating in public? Have you not heard of Las Vegas or New Orleans that shit is everywhere. It is also prevalent in many small towns where the local populace has decided fuck it. I worked in a small town bar after they banned smoking indoors in public places but you would never have known because no one gave a fuck and did it anyway.
Maybe it’s the walkable historical street, like a lot of American towns have these days?
It could be, I have one in my town.
As an American, the only thing in this picture you wouldn’t see at a trailer park are the fancy shops and restaurants in the background. Also the girl in red would be 450lbs (204kgs).
Trailer parks, the pinnacle of US urbanism. I can get on board with that.
I don’t get what I’m not supposed to comprehend. I suppose you can say I’m not comprehending.
Drinking in public…i guess? Or just having enough disposable income to go to a restaurant?
Having public spaces where lots of people hang out instead of TGI Fridays
Plenty of those here do can’t be that
Probably the socialized healthcare
I’d say this shitpost hit its mark
🌝
Personally, I’d say it’s long overdue that Europe reduces its reliance on the US. I am curious if it bothers you though, how much time you seem to spend thinking about America when I can assure you, the bulk of the population in the United States gives almost no thought to Europe at all?
There’s a reason the expression “Americans think 100 years is old, Europeans think 100 miles is far.” exists. The US is approximately 9,833,517 sq km, while Europe is approximately 10,180,000 sq km. Americans are too busy worrying about their own country. Why you even care about them at all is baffling. I would think you’d want them to go back to being isolationist.
Yes it bothers us. Unfortunately it’s fucking inescapable because americans on the internet will constantly assume everyone cares about their shitty country, hollywood movies are almost always US-centric, and unfortunately political shifts in a major world power are relevant for all their allies so it’s in the news as well.
I wish it wasn’t because outside of anything directly affecting us here and having some friends over there I don’t give two shits about murica.
We care about America out of necessity. America has pushed its tentacles into Europe for the last 90 years. That reliance was carefully crafted by the US.
Some of us have been arguing against reliance on and acceptance of the “American way” all this time, but the idea of a champion of freedom and democracy leading the world was a comforting lie for many (including Americans themselves) and while it lasted it did bring some form of stability.
And just to be clear; Americans may not think about Europe but they barely think about their own country either. I’m not saying European citizens are as informed as they should be but at least 50% of Americans are just so proudly pigignorant of their own history and government that it’s hard for an outsider to understand.
Our government has pushed its tentacles. Most US Americans would rather we mind our own business and focus on improving the climate and our health and well being. There are exceptions and some real crappy US Americans. Just like the AfD or the Nationalists in France or Swiss Peoples Party or Finns or various Freedom Parties of Europe. We are not unique over here, but there are many disenfranchised voters (targeted by republican dubious laws) that were not able to exercise their right to vote and that made it seem like we are all ignorant over here. We are not. There are millions of people protesting and organizing. State news and corporate owned news outlets aren’t letting the world know.
it’s hard for an outsider to understand.
That’s probably the only truly accurate part about America in your whole statement.
Prior to the current neo-imperialist period that began in 1945, the US was largely isolationist and non-interventionist.
Many current Americans don’t want to be a “champion of freedom and democracy” as you put it. Have you ever seen what happens if you kick a leg out from under a chair someone’s sitting on? You can’t just take it away all of a sudden.
The decisions and actions made by all parties since WWII have created these co-dependent environments and now it’s becoming apparent why they weren’t such a good idea.
As for thinking about their country, that’s pure speculation on your part as that “at least 50%” you call “proudly pig ignorant” would be about 160 million people.
I’d wager Americans think about their country every single day but they do so from a most impactful to least perspective. They think about it in terms of their local town or city, then state, then country.
Americans thinking the bad part of this is the smoking when it’s really the Marbella French restaurant charging you eight bucks for a side of mashed potatoes.
In their defense, there are few minds who can comprehend that one. Nuking this place from orbit could very well be the rekindling of US/Europe military collaboration.
Can’t comprehend what? Proceeds to focus on a single element of the photo and contextualize it within American culture
I comprehend cleavage
Yes, please lump all of us into the same category of ignorant hicks. I mean we are all so alike.
Couldn’t the same be said about Americans calling them Europeans? Heck, even within Italy alone there is a lot of variation.
It is natural that you stereotype, ESPECIALLY in a sarcastic instance like yurop
You mean how you just called people from the United States Americans? Maybe you forgot about Central and South America? There are 35 countries on this side of the pond. Also, there is a LOT of variety in the US. We have over fifty dialects and arguably more. We have people that are native German speakers (with several unique dialects and daughter languages, Latinos that are native Spanish speakers (along with many dialects and daughter languages from many countries as well), Native Americans with MANY cultural and linguistic differences from Alaska to South America.
Are you stupid? How am I supposed to call people from the US?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americans
Are there some other magic definitions?
Yep, I see name calling instead of intellectual discourse is your go to retort. Thanks for the enlightened conversation.
Okay but what do you call a person from the US?
The vast majority of the world refers to the United States when they say “American”. Not even talking about "Americas/“America”
The fact that you attacked my argument because I used the (correct) word Americans already indicates you are not interested at all in any conversation. So yeah, I don’t want to have one either with someone in such bad faith
I promise you no one from outside of the USA refers to themselves as American, without any other qualifiers. Referring to indigenous groups is also a disingenuous argument- in my experience if you ask one they are likely to self identify as the name of their specific tribe.
Are there proper-sized portions of food being served somewhere in this photo that I haven’t found?
Yeah the lady has every European’s favourite breakfast in her right hand duh 🙄
Hint: there are proper-sized people
I noticed that too, they’re nice and tall unlike the 5’1" amerikkkan creaturas
.
/s
Is it….sarcasm?
It’s dirty lungs and the stench of smoke ruining a beautiful moment is what it is
