I want to get more intentional about my fitness and measuring my performance and whatnot. As such, I’m in the market for fitness tracking technology for the first time.
However, I’m very much a Free Software / self-hosted sort of person, and I’m very un-thrilled about how proprietary all this stuff seems. It looks like the sensors themselves are kind of standardized (“ant+”, whatever that is), and some of the data formats can be imported and exported, but the bike computers themselves and the companion apps and the online services appear to be trying to become walled gardens.
Short of building a bike computer from components myself, what hardware and software should I be looking into?
Edit: my most immediate concern is figuring out what bike computer to get, to be able to log data from the ANT+ speed, cadence, and heart rate sensors I’ve already bought (along with a GPS track). I’m considering anything from a Wahoo ELEMNT Bolt V3 ($300), to an off-brand(?) one like a Magene C506 ($100) or iGPSSport BSC100S ($38), to using my smartphone with an ANT+ dongle and the “A Training Tracker” app (Github, Play Store).
Yeah there aren’t a lot of great options. For hardware there is Pebble + Gadgetbridge or possibly FitTrackee.
For Strava there are alternatives like Wanderer and FitPub. Although Wanderer is more directly comparable to TrailForks and FitPub is still very new and doesn’t have a ton of features.
I’ve got a Hammerhead Karoo 2 and have successfully been able to run apps like OSMAnd on it but it’s not a great experience.
Hmm, looking at Gadgetbridge, iGPSSPORT bike computers are "mostly supported, " so that’s helpful. The page lists a bunch of them individually but not the cheap BSC100S I was thinking about, so I wonder if that one doesn’t work or if it just isn’t tested.
Aside from it being open source, is there a reason you mentioned Pebble? Would a smart watch instead of a bike computer give a good experience for biking?
Aside from it being open source, is there a reason you mentioned Pebble?
It’s the only open source heart rate monitor that Im aware of. I bought an Amazfit watch before realizing before you can connect it to GadgetBridge you have to register an account with the watch creator so I returned it and never even bothered looking again. Even Pebble openly refuses to distribute their app outside of Google Play. This is why I say there aren’t any great options.
Would a smart watch instead of a bike computer give a good experience for biking?
I mean not for navigation. But what do you need other than that? My friend send me safe routes to ride and I need some way to navigate them so that’s why I have one.
It’s the only open source heart rate monitor that Im aware of.
Are the ANT+ heart rate monitor chest straps not just sorta generic? I realize that’s not the same as being open source, but if they’re too single-function to be running nontrivial software at all then I don’t care that much.
I mean not for navigation. But what do you need other than that? My friend send me safe routes to ride and I need some way to navigate them so that’s why I have one.
Well, I was thinking it’d be nice to see info like speed, cadence, and other sensor data while I ride. And I admit, the fancier features on some bike computers, like “hill climb planning,” seemed kinda neat.
Are the ANT+ heart rate monitor chest straps not just sorta generic?
ANT+ typically needs to connect to some other dedicated hardware for recording.
Right, that’s why I’m asking about bike computers (or a smartphone with an ANT+ dongle and appropriate software). I wanted data from several types of ANT+ sensors (speed, cadence, heart rate, maybe even a power meter eventually) and that’s part of why I was questioning your suggestion of a smart watch instead.
A Pebble has a heart rate monitor built in, I think, but can those other sensors pair with it?
The point is the Pebbl connects directly to your phone, so no other devices needed. If you need all those other sensors a bike computer can be a good place to send them. There just aren’t any “free” options that I’m aware of.
Of the various proprietary bike computers, are they all equally sketchy/enshittified? Or are some brands less bad than others?
I’ve heard good things about https://codeberg.org/endurain-project/endurain
I use https://github.com/open-wanderer/wanderer for hiking, might be some help for planning trails?
I sincerely hope you have better luck than I finding a Strava/MapMyRide/Trailforks/MTBProjec alternative that 1) works 2) has at the very least a quarter of the features of the proprietary apps and 3) is accurate. I have searched for over a year and tried an endless number of apps and have not found a single one that allows me to look at a trail map, record my ride or provide me accurate data at the end of the ride. I eventually gave up and carry an old phone with Play services on it so I can use Strava during the ride. If my experience is an indicator, there is no reliable and useful alternative.
It’s actually not that bad depending on what you are trying to achieve. Many bike computers will show up as mass storage if you plug it them into your computer and you will be able to get the GPX files out of there without using some app or server or proprietary service. GPX files are just textfiles with a timestamp and a GPS coordinate. So they are a three as free as it gets. I’m using Geo Activity Playground on my computer to analyze my activities. That software shows me the tracks and overall statistics, heat maps and so on. Everything I was using Strava for. It’s great. If you want to get more into training, you might want to try Golden Cheetah.
Many bike computers will show up as mass storage if you plug it them into your computer and you will be able to get the GPX files out of there without using some app or server or proprietary service.
Which ones? That’s (one of) the kind(s) of information I was trying to find out from this thread!
My Bryton Rider 15 does it, but if you have a certain model you want to buy, try to search for “model name mass storage” or something like this.
I have enjoyed RideWithGPS. There are various tiers, and the free tier gets you a lot of features you might be looking for with the paid tiers providing more features related to route planning. It can be integrated with computers (I now use a wahoo) or run from a phone in your jersey pocket. It can connect with other services like Strava if you want to share your ride data there. Routes can be imported/exported in a variety of formats and I believe other sensors like heart rate / power / cadence can be added in, but I don’t personally use those so don’t take my word on that.
Good luck
Are there major differences in bike computer brands re: compatibility with third-party services and devices, or does everything just support standards? I get the impression that Wahoo and Garmin are the most prominent brands, but does that translate into “ecosystem” advantages?
My understanding is that most of the major brands of computers will integrate with most ride planning / tracking apps pretty easily.
Here’s what I use:
- Computer: Wahoo and their free tier mobile app (cost of device + free)
- Ride Planning / Tracking: RideWithGPS Basic plan paid yearly instead of monthly (~$55/yr)
- Weather: Klimat ($5/yr)
- Social: Strava (free)
Flow = Plan route in RWGPS (desktop or mobile) --> Send to Wahoo Device --> Start ride on Wahoo Device (pick route or just go) --> end ride on computer --> sync to wahoo app --> auto-syncs with Klimat / RWGPS / Strava --> manually add photos, descriptions, or whatever in RWGPS or Strava.
Obviously not all of that is necessary, and I don’t do that for even half my rides. I’m pretty sure something else could add weather info to my ride reports, but whatever…Klimat is $5/yr and I already have it set-up.
I don’t have a ton of experience with different bike computer brands as I basically went from using a phone on my rides to getting a Wahoo at Christmas one year. Other major brands in the computer space are Garmin, Coros, and Hammerhead.
I personally switched away from phone-only as I ride in a lot of places without cell service and I found I was using up my phone battery while riding to the point I couldn’t use my phone for making phone calls.
Wahoo also has two of their own apps - one I’ve never figured out (Element) but I think is used more for like live ride-tracking, like if i wanted to share my location, speed, distance, etc with you during a ride. The other is the Wahoo app, which I can use to import routes and it shows me some basic ride data after my rides. This app also has a lot of training features which it sounds like you might be more interested in. For instance it’ll ask me to rate my effort after a ride, then use that combined with ride time and other metrics to “score” my ride. It’ll also recommend workouts. As someone who just “rode my bike” this takes a little bit of getting used to. It’ll tell you when you’re rides aren’t really doing much for your progress (e.g. doing the same 20mile ride everyday may not be helping you build endurance or get better at hills) or it may tell you that you need to back off and take a rest day. Of course like most apps in this space they want you to pay extra for a subscription service that unlocks even more. I just use the unpaid tier in this app. I believe Garmin and Wahoo are probably the strongest in this sense…I don’t doubt that Coros and Hammerhead make good computers but I haven’t heard anything about the app support that comes with them.
One thing I have heard (which I don’t have yet) is that a chest strap heart rate monitor is going to give you a lot better body metrics than the computer will guess at or a smart watch bouncing around on your wrist might be able to provide. These can be pretty reasonably priced as well. Power meters can provide a lot of other metrics, but the price of those doesn’t match my interest level in that data.
I personally found Strava’s environment to be too locked down in terms of planning/sharing route info, and I have no rider friends so the social media aspect that they’re big on kind of does nothing for me. I still have it as it’s the app I first started with and my rides sync to it automatically, but I mostly use it to get discount codes from completing challenges now. And there’s a couple local people who have a group that I follow and they publish a variety of routes in my state. I basically hid myself away on that app (profile is mostly private, I turned off the local legend stuff, and I don’t allow people to see where I start/end my rides, what times I’m riding etc)
There’s certainly a lot of choices and it can be kind of a pain to get it all configured to talk to each other ( and like I alluded to with Klimat, I’m not eager to go changing my setup now that I’ve got things working the way I like). It’s also easy to get lost in chasing the “is this ride improving my performance” trap. If training is your interest and you’re genuinely wanting to see stats improving all that can help and more power to you. But if you also like riding your bike for fun, mental health, getting into nature, etc. remember that it’s ok to skip all the data and just have a ride that puts a smile on your face too.
Is the Wahoo computer absolutely tied to the Wahoo app (as in, that app being the only way to get data off the device), or are there other ways to do it (a third-party app or mounting the bike computer as a filesystem and copying files off)?
Does either the Wahoo device or app ever behave badly (e.g. nag you to upgrade to a paid tier, display other ads at you, try to trick you into sending Wahoo your data even after you said no, etc.)?
(Basically, if I settle for a proprietary device and/or software, I want to pick the stuff least likely to abuse me that way.)
It’s also easy to get lost in chasing the “is this ride improving my performance” trap. If training is your interest and you’re genuinely wanting to see stats improving all that can help and more power to you. But if you also like riding your bike for fun, mental health, getting into nature, etc. remember that it’s ok to skip all the data and just have a ride that puts a smile on your face too.
Right now I mostly ride for utility/transportation purposes, but that isn’t enough to keep me in shape. I’m trying to “game-ify” it a little bit so that I exercise more consistently. (Speaking of which, I’d like an open source alternative to Zwift too, LOL)
So supposedly you can pull .fit files from the Wahoo with a USB connection to your computer. I tried - I had to do an update on the unit, then in the app I had to go to Settings and enable USB connections then also enable the transfer of FIT files
(that option didn’t show until after the firmware update). I didn’t see any FIT files in /exports or elsewhere, so ?? - It’s not their “standard option” for sure.
As for nags - none that I’ve experienced. They started with all the access as a time-limited trial, then that gets downgraded to the free tier after a month or so. Not a big deal. Strava will bug you to upgrade the most out of my “stack”
Gadgetbridge supports some Garmin bike computers, and there may be some early support for other devices if you check the git repo.
Besides that, since Garmin devices at least can be run offline I’ve taken to manually documenting important data in a table. This might sound annoying, but it only takes a minute or two and forces me to reflect on the workout, compared to just passively collecting data. And it also means I’m in control of the data and since it’s not tied to any device or ecosystem, I can switch to a different watch/bike computer in the future without any threat to my data.
And if you structure the data correctly (and you are technically inclined) you can still build your own graphs, calculate statistics, etc
I’m pretty sure you can connect the Garmin to a computer and access the files, and grab the fit files with your activities. Might not be an open way to analyze them right now, but having them would be the first step for future planning.
Yeah, that’s another approach. It’s a bit bugged on my Linux system unfortunately, but a good option if gadgetbridge or other alternatives are not supported for a given device.
Open your mind, Quaid.
You might be extremely neurotic.
Maybe your librarian will give you suggestions on books to read.
The amount of people that want to be tracked incessantly kind of amazes me…
What an absolutely disrespectful, trash comment.
First of all, who the fuck do you think you are, to be calling me “neurotic?”
Second, I don’t want to “be tracked;” I want to track myself for my own use. Get it right.
Third, if I didn’t want that I wouldn’t have posted to begin with. So WTF do you think you’re accomplishing trying to condescendingly tell me my wants are wrong?
If you don’t have anything useful to say, delete your bullshit and don’t say anything at all.
From Wikipedia:
Highly neurotic people have more trouble coping with stressful events, are more likely to insult or lash out at others, and are more likely to interpret ordinary situations (like minor frustrations) as hopelessly difficult. Neuroticism is closely related to mood disorders such as anxiety and depression.
Damn. I nailed it.
Maybe head back to Reddit?
Bicycling should be enjoyed. I’d throw all that junk away and just ride.
Personally I enjoyed riding without all the gadgets way more, but I do see the appeal.
“I need the data to know whether I really exercised.”
“My ride doesn’t count unless my numbers are good.”
“I can’t enjoy riding without constant feedback.”
“The device must prove I’m healthy/fit/doing enough.”
Sounds fun.
No one needs to play psychologist to know you’re a fucking cunt.
I’ll bet he smugly rides a steel frame, too.
I’m a cock. And I wouldn’t fuck your cunt if it was the last one on the planet Earth.
What a fucking stupid troll.
This.
That being said I have a Wahoo Kickr turbo trainer from 2019. The app that I need to work with it went through a series of updates that expanded the tracking, prioritised cloud storage, and placed ads on the screen. What I found is that installing a much earlier functional version of the app gets what you want if you can block updates. So maybe, if you can find out what version of the app you like was the last before the enshitification, download that APK and stick with that.
This.
No, not “this.” That guy is an asshole trying to tell me that what I want is wrong. For the record, I actually do want what I asked for and do not have an X/Y problem.
Thank you for the advice about using old pre-enshittification versions of apps, though.
Goddamn! I’m sorry people are giving you such a hard time for wanting to collect some data from your rides and use it for planning and stuff.
I want a similar thing for running and it’s really painful. I do not want to subscribe to an app and I don’t want to send my data to some company for monetization. I just want to collect and use the data myself.
I grew up in the 90s and got my first computer in 95. Seeing how awesome the world of software was back then has made me so damn depressed about the subscription hellhole we live in now.
Fuck these morons. I’m not saying it’s for you but peleton has been insanely helpful tracking my fitness progress. Good luck finding one that works for you.
Regardless of who he is or how tackless he is: the point that just going out there and enjoying the ride is golden and shouldn’t be lost on you.
Do you even begin to understand how fucking presumptuous it is to assume I need to be told that? I have been riding bikes for decades and have never used a bike computer. I wanted advice for the thing I don’t already know plenty about, not the thing that I do!
You two need to get a clue that this discussion is supposed to be about bicycling and your high horses aren’t welcome.
I’m a professional bike mechanic. If you’re in my store I’d sell you everything you want more. But here I’m just being honest. 90% of the people I sell that shit to… They want it removed within 6 months. “Distracting” is the most common complaint. Extra weight. Extra fuss. Extra gear. Most cyclists want to travel light. (And your smartphone can handle a lot if you feel nerdy.)
It’s a neuroticism. I’m not insulting you. That’s just the definitional word. The other 10% post their shit on Strava and 90% still don’t give a fuck.
But you do. You really do. So do it. You got the money. Go to your LBS and tell them your budget and what you want and I’m sure they will gladly hook you up.
Lol I’m a bike mechanic, and we put that stuff on people’s bikes all the time, and they never ask for it to be removed.
You’re just being an ass. Okay it’s something you aren’t interested in, fine, but there’s no need to be an asshole to the people that are interested in the data. Just because you can’t handle seeing data and being unable to have fun, doesn’t mean everyone else has the same problem.
Nobody puts that shit on their bikes these days except old people who don’t know how to use a smartphone.
You just want to pontificate and aren’t paying attention to anything I’m actually saying. I don’t want the proprietary shit normies think is good. A random LBS employee will not be able to help me – case in point, you sure as hell aren’t!
What I need is advice from people at the intersection of bicycling and being Free Software weirdos. Hence asking on Lemmy.
Narcissistic too with an antipersonality disorder.
Watch out everybody, we got a serial thriller.
Just cadence. It’s so easy! Pedal.
